West Farms Junction - The Early Years in New Haven Railroad Discussions Forum

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West Farms Junction - The Early Years

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Statkowski	West Farms Junction - The Early Years	Lead	[-]
Posts: 2903 Apr 3 10 5:15 AM Local user Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Tags : None Along came the New York, Westchester & Boston, so, Voila!, West Farms Junction was born. The passenger platforms off in the distance are for the West Farms passenger depot. The track numbers, from top to bottom, are 6 & 5 (freight tracks), 4 (eastward local passenger track), 2 & 1 (express passenger tracks) and 3 (westward passenger track) (6-5-4-2-1-3). Note the locations of the passenger platforms for the Westchester Avenue station - tracks 3 & 4. Then, no sooner had they gotten finished with all that new trackwork, along came Hell Gate Bridge. Two tracks became dedicated for Harlem River passenger service, and two for Hell Gate Bridge passenger service. Now, west of S.S. 8 the track numbers got shuffled around, so, from top to bottom, it's tracks 6 & 5 (freight tracks), 4 & 3 (Hell Gate Bridge passenger tracks) and 2 & 1 (Harlem River passenger tracks) (6-5-4-3-2-1). The trackage east of the tower remained as before. Note, now, that the passenger platforms at the Westchester Avenue station have also been relocated. Last Edited By: Statkowski Apr 3 10 5:39 AM. Edited 1 time.
NHRHTA1	Platforms	#1	[-]
Posts: 4080 Apr 3 10 6:46 AM Chairman of the Board, NHRHTA http://www.nhrhta.org Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Very interesting Henry. They moved ALL the platforms west of SS8 after the reconfiguration of the Junction Hunts Point Casanova ETC. What I still have not run down yet is what year the NHRR MU trains stopped running into Harlem River station proper. All terminated at Hunts Point and a transfer was made to Westchester trains (another inconveince to be sure). THe ETT's from 1915 show through trains starting out for Harlem River in Stamford and Portchester. So the great dream of the HR terminal died fairly early. What I have not figured out fronm these Diagrams which I have seen some time ago is how the rare Westchester Freight got over to Oak Point yard? Was it at SS4?
Statkowski		#2	[-]
Posts: 2903 Apr 3 10 7:16 AM Local user Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Best guess is that the freight ran into Harlem River and scooted by the passenger depot to the left, around the back side of the yard office building. No Oak Point connection, just Harlem River. The April 24, 1927 public timetable shows all New Haven trains terminating at Hunt's Point, with connecting service (NYW&B) to Harlem River. New Rochelle locals 306 & 307 still handled baggage (between New Rochelle and Hunt's Point only). There were five round trips a day, Monday thru Saturday, and two round trips on Sunday. The S.S. 4 diagram shows a crossover from the "NYW&B" tracks to the New Haven's track 3 (only), and this would have permitted the deadheading MUT to clear the NYW&B tracks in order to reverse ends without blocking any NYW&B westward trains (track 1 to track 3, reverse ends, back onto track 2 for the return to New Rochelle. Last Edited By: Statkowski Apr 3 10 8:52 AM. Edited 2 times.
NHRHTA1		#3	[-]
Posts: 4080 Apr 3 10 5:35 PM Chairman of the Board, NHRHTA http://www.nhrhta.org Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Are you sure the NHRR trains used 1&2 west of SS8 and not 3&4? East of SS8 it still was 3, 1, 2, 4, 5, 6 this was until 1935 when 1&2 were lifted. Originaly it was a 4 track passenger RR 3, 1, 2, 4, alongside a two track freight RR 5, 6. 3&4 being the outside local tracks and 1&2 the express tracks. After the Reconfiguration west of SS8 you then had a two tracks dedicated to the NYW&B two passenger tracks 3&4 for NHRR traffic and of course the freight tracks 5&6. Essentially two, 2 track passenger RR's with a 2 track freight RR. SS8 must have been one busy place at one time. P. E. Lynch solved the mystery in an upcomming Shoreliner article of why SS8 was cut in half by the way. Last Edited By: NHRHTA1 Apr 3 10 5:39 PM. Edited 1 times.
NHRHTA1	SS7	#4	[-]
Posts: 4080 Apr 3 10 5:45 PM Chairman of the Board, NHRHTA http://www.nhrhta.org Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Interesting that the SS7 signals are not shown. I surmise The home signals fro the Draw were under control of the SS7 op then?
Statkowski		#5	[-]
Posts: 2903 Apr 3 10 6:04 PM Local user Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Okay, what NH trains are we talking about? If we're talking about trains going to Penn. Station, then they switched over to tracks 3 & 4 at S.S. 8. If we're talking about Harlem River Branch local trains, then they had to use tracks 1 & 2, even if they were terminating early at Hunt's Point (from 1927 or so onward) - simply because that's where the passenger platforms had been relocated to. That also explains the track 1/2/3 crossover at S.S. 4. No other explanation can explain the reason for that somewhat isolated crossover, essentially totally separate from Oak Point Yard. Absent any evidence to the contrary, that's my educated guess on how things went down. In 1911, the NH had 29 local trains each weekday running from Harlem River to New Rochelle with no NYW&B trains. In 1916 they had 21 local trains with a multitude of NYW&B trains. In 1919 they had 19 local trains (along with a multitude of NYW&B trains), but also had 5 Penn. Station trains. In 1927 they had 5 local trains mixed with NYW&B traffic. By July 1930 they had no local service and S.S. 8 was subsequently eliminated along with the switches it controlled. Concerning S.S. 7, Bronx River Drawbridge, the westward signals were located on Bridge 79 (they're shown on the second S.S. 8 diagram, but not marked since S.S. 7 controlled them). The eastward bridge signals were those shown at the Westchester Avenue station, with S.S. 7 controlling them as Home signals and S.S. 8 controlling them as Rear Home signals. Last Edited By: Statkowski Apr 3 10 6:10 PM. Edited 2 times.
NHRHTA1	SS7-SS8	#6	[-]
Posts: 4080 Apr 3 10 9:58 PM Chairman of the Board, NHRHTA http://www.nhrhta.org Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Yes, Thanks Henry. That makes sense. I think one of the reasons for the NHRR local services steady decline was the Dual Contracts extension of the Pelham Bay line (Lexington ave Subway) which was finished around 1916-1917. The Nickle fare would have syphoned off alot of traffic From Baychester Westward. Hunts point was an interesting terminus for the NHRR Locals also, wonder if it anything to do with the Pelham Bay Express Stop about a block and a half away? The connection to the 2nd and 3rd Ave Els was a long walk at Harlem River after the 129th St IRT shuttles came off. Last Edited By: NHRHTA1 Apr 4 10 7:09 AM. Edited 1 times.
Statkowski		#7	[-]
Posts: 2903 Apr 4 10 5:53 AM Local user Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	From an operational viewpoint, Hunt's Point made sense. Transfer to the Interborough Rapid Transit was no more than the transfer at 125th Street, and the crossover capabilities of S.S. 4's interlocking plant were only 2/3rds of a mile distant, minimizing deadhead moves. Terminal charges for Harlem River were totally eliminated, dumping everything onto the NYW&B. With no crossover capabilities at Westchester Avenue (even though the I.R.T. transfer was closer), nonrevenue deadheading would have been increased (still all the way to S.S. 4). Once the arriving New Haven train offloaded its passenger(s), it immediately had to clear the track for the arriving NYW&B train. The only downside was the extremely short turnaround time for weekday trains returning to New Rochelle: * No. 303 arrived at Hunt's Point at 6:40 a.m. Its return, No. 304, departed at 6:45 a.m. - a five minute turnaround. * No. 307 arrived at Hunt's Point at 7:55 a.m. Its return, No. 306, departed at 8:00 a.m. - a five minute turnaround. * No. 311 arrived at Hunt's Point at 10:41 a.m. Its return, No. 310, departed at 10:58 a.m. - a seventeen minute turnaround. * No. 317 arrived at Hunt's Point at 4:15 p.m. Its return, No. 318, departed at 4:18 p.m. - a three minute turnaround. * No. 319 arrived at Hunt's Point at 5:16 p.m. Its return, No. 320, departed at 5:20 p.m. - a four minute turnaround. Of course, all this is assuming they just used one set of equipment with one crew. Had they used two sets of equipment, and two crews, deadheading between Hunt's Point and Harlem River would still have been required (with no real savings). The track arrangement at S.S. 4 didn't permit movement into Oak Point Yard to clear the running tracks, and the layover time would have been too great to allow track 3 at S.S. 4 to be blocked while waiting for the return trip. Of course, by 1927 the local trains were probably down to two or three cars, so having the motorman relocate from one end of the train to the other wouldn't have taken all that long. I guess the train crews just really, really had to hustle. Oh, Nos. 307 and 306 had baggage to offload/onload. Last Edited By: Statkowski Apr 4 10 9:57 AM. Edited 1 times.
Mike Ribuffo	NYW&B Freight	#8	[-]
Posts: 41 Apr 4 10 4:56 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Wayne & Henry - Concerning how the NYW&B got to Oak Point Yard - SS4 at one time had a continuous set of slip switches making it possible to go directly from NYW&B track 1 into the east end of the yard. These appear in an earlier version of the SS4 interlocking drawing than the 1941 revision that Henry posted. The remnamts of this set of slips is still visible in the 1941 version ( see lever 25 and lock L-27), but the lower half was reconfigured as two individual cross-overs (shifted slightly east). I don't have the earlier drawing in front of me, but it came from Wayne's collection. Concerning whether the NH locals ran on tracks 1 &2 into Harlem River - My assumption is that they did so following the 1919 reconstruction of SS8, as the interlocking seems designed to route the NH locals to/from NH local tracks 3&4 (east of SS8) to 1 & 2 west of SS8 - at least until the NH locals stopped running into Harlem River terminal at all. Note also that within Harlem River yard, tracks 1 &2 were relocated onto a new embankment (that covered the former steam loco roundhouse site) enroute to the HR passenger station. I'm not sure when this addditional change occurred (possibly in late 1920s, as indicated by the SS1 interlocking diagram Henry posted), as the steam loco facilities would have likely remained in use until the Bay Ridge Branch was electrified in 1927. - Mike R
DBrion		#9	[-]
Posts: 590 Apr 4 10 7:39 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Not knowing how many trains equal a "multitude of NYW&B trains", any guess on the total number of daily movements through West Farms Junction on a weekday, say in 1916 or 1919? Must have been a busy place. This must have cost a small fortune to build.
Statkowski		#10	[-]
Posts: 2903 Apr 5 10 3:56 AM Local user Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	As previously stated, "Absent any evidence to the contrary...." One thing to remember about double-slip (a/k/a puzzle) switches, it took five (5) levers to control them - two switch levers, two lock levers, and one movable point frog lever. Concerning the train counts for 1916 or 1919, I do have a Harlem River Branch extract of Time Table No. 68 (June1916) and No. 77 (June 1919). I'll count up all the trains and get back to you.
Statkowski		#11	[-]
Posts: 2903 Apr 5 10 4:43 AM Local user Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	June 1916 count: Eastward - 107 NYW&B trains, 21 NH trains, 2 Adams Express trains (carfloated from Jersey City to Oak Point) Westward - 105 NYW&B trains, 21 NH trains, 2 Adams Express trains (carfloated to Jersey City from Oak Point) Plus freight trains, local and long haul.
NHRHTA1	SS8	#12	[-]
Posts: 4080 Apr 5 10 7:21 AM Chairman of the Board, NHRHTA http://www.nhrhta.org Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Im assuming the Op job was a NH roster job?
pattbaa	West Farms sub-station	#13	[-]
Posts: 151 Apr 5 10 7:57 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Henry , was AB 83-H the distrubution location where the power generated at Sherman Creek was switched to the track-circuits? And was there a phase-break at the point where the Trolleys and Feeders energized with power from West Farms "meet" the Trolleys and Feeders energized with power from Cos Cob?. New Haven trains operated on power from two points- the AB behind the train and the AB the train was approaching. For example , at the end of the electrified zone West of Mt. Vernon , for a train headed for GCT power was conducted to the train from both theNew Rochelle sub-station ( behind the train ) and AB0 sub-station ( ahead of the train). This arrangment much reduced the transmission losses. If a train was exactly mid-way between two substations 5 miles apart , then 1/2 of the power was conducted thru 2.5 miles of Trolley & Rail from the substation behind the train , and the other 1/2 thru 2.5 miles of Trolley & Rail from the sub-station ahead of the train. There was an "out-of-step" protective-relay at Cos Cob that would detect if two different power supplies , possibly West Farms and Cos Cob , or Cos Cob and Devon, were not synchronized. I'll try to obtain more specific information for anyone interested.
Statkowski		#14	[-]
Posts: 2903 Apr 5 10 5:11 PM Local user Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	First things first - train frequency. From the June 1919 Time Table. Hell Gate Bridge is now in operation. Are all crossover moves are being made at S.S. 4? Or S.S. 8? The rearranged layout at S.S. 8, according to the interlocking diagram, may have taken effect December 1915 ("NEW CROSSOVERS & LOCKING PUT IN SERVICE DEC. 24, 1915"), but the photo of the rearranging is dated October 1919. Someone with access to the UCONN records might be able to come up with an answer. Anyway, in 1919, eastward trains consisted of: * 105 NYW&B trains * 21 NH Harlem River trains * 4 or 5 NH Hell Gate Bridge trains * 2 Adams Express trains Westward trains consisted of: * 106 NYW&B trains * 21 NH Harlem River trains * 4 or 5 NH Hell Gate Bridge trains * 2 Adams Express trains The 4 or 5 Hell Gate Bridge trains consisted of the following: * The Federal Express and the Colonial Express, Daily * Two express trains operating in and out of Sunnyside, not Penn. Station * The Bar Harbor Express running on Monday, Wednesday & Friday (thus the 4 or 5 depending on what particular day of the week you were looking at). Yes, Wayne, the Adams Express trains were New Haven trains. Even though the bridge was up and running, for some reason these two trains still were carfloated between Jersey City and Oak Point. Does 100+ NYW&B trains each way constitute a multitude? I think so, especially when compared to the New Haven's own traffic. Okay, on to power distribution and such. From the Westinghouse Electric & Manufacturing Company Special Publication 1698 dated June 1914, and entitled, "New York, New Haven & Hartford Railroad Electrification," here's Figure 19 - Schematic Diagram of Line, Showing Three-Phase Substations and Power Supply: We then switch to Figure 21 - Schematic Diagram of Distribution System with Locations of Auto-Transformers: Then we switch to a closer look at what was happening closer to New York City: Anchor Bridge 83-H may well have been the feed point. I didn't see it specifically mentioned in the Westinghouse publication except for the diagrams shown. However, to further explain phase breaks and such to the hoi polloi, here's an extract of Rule 1604 from the Time Table: Phase break signals consisting of a circle of yellow lights approximately 4 feet in diameter against a black background in service at the following locations: WEST FARMS - On highway bridge No. 3.80 (East 174th St.) 8187 feet east of S.S. 4 for westward trains. On anchor bridge No. 83-H, 7913 feet east of S.S. 4 for eastward trains. When these signals are illuminated all electrically operated trains, regardless of direction or track, will lower pantographs 75 feet before passing anchor bridges No. 867 and No. 83-H and keep them down until pantographs of all equipment in train have passed 75 feet beyond these anchor bridges. In case you're curious about the need for the preceding, having a running electric motor suddenly switch from one 25-cycle (or any cycle) alternating current to another ever-so-slightly off alternating current can be disastrous to the motor and anyone (or anything) around it. Many, many years ago, at Consolidated Edison's Hell Gate power plant in Astoria, Queens, a generator was switched in without first ensuring everything was in phase. The remnants of the massive generator are still to this day embedded in the concrete ceiling of the plant, some 100 feet above.
DBrion		#15	[-]
Posts: 590 Apr 5 10 5:39 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Henry Statkowski - Several kudos go to you for such fantastic and clear explanations!! Assuming majority of movements between 5:00AM and 11:00PM (or 18 hours in a 24 hr. period) that would approach 15 movements per hour, on average 1 every 4 minutes. A very busy place. Thank you for the information.
Statkowski		#16	[-]
Posts: 2903 Apr 5 10 6:14 PM Local user Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	At S.S. 8, West Farms Junction, 5:00 a.m. to 7:59 a.m.: 5:08 a.m. - NYNH&H No. 179 to Penn. Station and No. 180 to Boston 5:24 a.m. - NYW&B No. 723 to Harlem River 6:05 a.m. - NYW&B No. 804 to White Plains 6:07 a.m. - NYNH&H No. 301 to Harlem River 6:09 a.m. - NYW&B No. 605 to Harlem River 6:33 a.m. - NYW&B No. 801 to Harlem River 6:39 a.m. - NYW&B No. 607 to Harlem River 6:40 a.m. - NYW&B No. 606 to Port Chester 6:49 a.m. - NYNH&H No. 302 to New Rochelle 6:53 a.m. - NYW&B No. 609 to Harlem River 6:59 a.m. - NYW&B No. 803 to Harlem River 7:00 a.m. - NYW&B No. 806 to White Plains 7:06 a.m. - NYW&B No. 608 to Port Chester 7:16 a.m. - NYNH&H No. 303 to Harlem River 7:20 a.m. - NYW&B No. 610 to Port Chester 7:23 a.m. - NYW&B No. 805 to Harlem River 7:26 a.m. - NYW&B No. 808 to White Plains 7:29 a.m. - NYW&B No. 611 to Harlem River 7:36 a.m. - NYNH&H No. 305 to Harlem River 7:43 a.m. - NYW&B No.613 to Harlem River 7:49 a.m. - NYW&B No. 807 to Harlem River 7:50 a.m. - NYW&B No. 810 to White Plains 7:53 a.m. - NYNH&H No. 304 to New Rochelle 7:56 a.m. - NYW&B No. 612 to Port Chester On the bright side, S.S. 8 had a Union Switch & Signal Type "F" electro-mechanical machine.
Statkowski		#17	[-]
Posts: 2903 Apr 5 10 6:45 PM Local user Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	For a real headache, here's 5:00 p.m. to 7:59 p.m.: 5:03 p.m. - NYNH&H No. 324 to New Rochelle and NYW&B No. 669 to Harlem River 5:09 p.m. - NYW&B No. 863 to Harlem River 5:10 p.m. - NYW&B No. 866 to White Plains 5:17 p.m. - NYW&B No. 668 to Port Chester 5:22 p.m. - NYNH&H No. 326 to New Rochelle 5:23 p.m. - NYW&B No. 865 to Harlem River 5:27 p.m. - NYNH&H No. 329 to Harlem River 5:29 p.m. - NYW&B No. 671 to Harlem River 5:30 p.m. - NYW&B No. 670 to Port Chester 5:33 p.m. - NYNH&H No. 328 to New Rochelle 5:36 p.m. - NYW&B No. 868 to White Plains 5:43 p.m. - NYW&B No. 673 to Harlem River 5:45 p.m. - NYNH&H No. 331 to Harlem River 5:49 p.m. - NYW&B No. 867 to Harlem River 5:50 p.m. - NYW&B No. 870 to White Plains 5:52 p.m. - NYNH&H No. 330 to New Rochelle 5:56 p.m. - NYW&B No. 672 to Port Chester 6:03 p.m. - NYW&B No. 869 to Harlem River 6:09 p.m. - NYW&B No. 675 to Harlem River 6:10 p.m. - NYW&B No. 674 to Port Chester 6:13 p.m. - NYNH&H No. 332 to New Rochelle 6:14 p.m. - NYNH&H No. 333 to Harlem River 6:16 p.m. - NYW&B No. 872 to White Plains 6:23 p.m. - NYW&B No. 677 to Harlem River 6:29 p.m. - NYW&B No. 871 to Harlem River 6:30 p.m. - NYW&B No. 874 to White Plains 6:36 p.m. - NYW&B No. 676 to Port Chester 6:43 p.m. - NYW&B No. 873 to Harlem River 6:49 p.m. - NYW&B No. 679 to Harlem River 6:50 p.m. - NYW&B No. 678 to Port Chester 6:53 p.m. - NYNH&H No. 334 to New Rochelle 6:56 p.m. - NYW&B No. 876 to White Plains 7:03 p.m. - NYW&B No. 681 to Harlem River 7:09 p.m. - NYW&B No. 875 to Harlem River 7:10 p.m. - NYW&B No. 878 to White Plains 7:12 p.m. - NYNH&H No. 176 to Worcester, Mon./Wed./Fri. 7:16 p.m. - NYW&B No. 680 to Port Chester 7:21 p.m. - NYNH&H No. 337 to Harlem River 7:24 p.m. - NYW&B No. 683 to Harlem River 7:30 p.m. - NYW&B No. 682 to Port Chester 7:43 p.m. - NYW&B No. 685 to Harlem River 7:49 p.m. - NYW&B No. 879 to Harlem River 7:50 p.m. - NYW&B No. 882 to White Plains 7:54 p.m. - NYNH&H No. 338 to New Rochelle 7:56 p.m. - NYW&B No. 684 to Port Chester
NHRHTA1	YEAR	#18	[-]
Posts: 4080 Apr 5 10 8:04 PM Chairman of the Board, NHRHTA http://www.nhrhta.org Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Thats 1919 Right Henry? BTW how you doin?
Statkowski		#19	[-]
Posts: 2903 Apr 6 10 4:06 AM Local user Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Yes. Wayne, it's 1919. Didn't have any Hell Gate Bridge traffic in 1914. I'm doing fine, ribs are slowly healing.
Rick Abramson		#20	[-]
Posts: 2831 Apr 6 10 9:47 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Any ideas as to why when SS-8 was removed from service, the bottom half of the tower remained? Perhaps the equipment trust wasn't paid off on that part of the tower?